Talk:Dumbarton Rock

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Need to have a think about how were going to structure the Dumbie guide, we've got three climbing styles to incorporate. Anyone have any thoughts how todo this? I think splitting the area into Trad, sport, bouldering on separate pages seems most sensibe. Need to workout how to do separate pages within the same route first! --Dredpath 13:06, 1 June 2006 (BST)


Thread titleRepliesLast modified
Is Sufferance 8a or 7c+? Consensus?1216:16, 11 June 2011
Tolerance1309:31, 2 September 2010
Merge with dumbarton rock bouldering?819:12, 4 May 2010

Is Sufferance 8a or 7c+? Consensus?

It pains me to know, but no point deluding myself any more than I already am!? be honest and only if you have red pointed it... :-)

Mark McGowan14:13, 2 May 2010


I did it in 2007 as my first "8a". Since then I've tried other 8's but not done any until yesterday (yaay!) so comparing the 2 is difficult. Sufference took me a lot longer than Dum Dum Boys and Tarrier. Out of the three, Dum Dum Boys was the easiest, but sufference and tarrier were about the same. It's certainly a grade harder than Dum Dum Boys and any of the 7c+'s that I've done at Dumbuck, for me anyway, but I think the dumbuck routes are really soft! Sorry this hasn't been the most helpful reply, but I can't really remember. It's either hard 7c+ or soft 8a.

Michael Lee15:20, 2 May 2010

Thanks Mike When I did Tarrier, I remember it being a solid 7c+ (no less, no more - a bloc move low down then nice and steady above), I did DD boys in two evenings but i think a long reach takes the bite out of the crux move but Sufferance seems allot more technical and would be harder to onsight and therefore makes me think it should be soft 8a? cheers for that...

Mark McGowan15:51, 2 May 2010

went on sufferance this morning for a refresher after being on Endurance at dumby and have definitely concluded both are 8a unless you are 60ft tall...

Mark McGowan14:43, 3 June 2010

Can't really believe tarrier is 8a though. A boulder problem (easier than that on Omerta 7c) to a decent-ish rest, then 7b roughly to the top. It's been 7c+ for ages. 7c+'s are hard, get over it.

Michael Lee19:22, 18 August 2010

Maybe your right Mike. Although I found Omerta ok at the time and tarrier a bit harder crux and more pumpy than Omerta? but hey your right 7c+'s are hard.

Mark McGowan19:56, 18 August 2010

I personally think that Sufferance is very soft 8a and a gift at the grade, Tarrier is way harder and definitely 8a. If Tarrier isn't 8a then I reckon a lot of routes that I have done have been graded wrongly. Most people that have done the routes on this wall will tell you that Tarrier is the hardest so if it isn't 8a then none of the routes on this wall are?

Willackers10:48, 21 August 2010

Benchmark F7d.

Fiend17:31, 31 August 2010


Willackers19:06, 31 August 2010

Haha 7c++

Good effort yesterday Fiend!

Michael Lee19:51, 31 August 2010


Mark McGowan20:36, 2 September 2010

Time to re-open this discussion. Not so much about the grade, more the line.

I've recently started working this route and I'm honestly not too fussed if it's 7c+ or 8a, I just want to do the route, as it requires good technique and you can't just burl through it (i.e. my normal approach...). But, what is the route?

Someone at the crag the other day commented that the Old Guard of Dumby wouldn't be too happy about the gully start.(i.e. spanning in from the left at the 2nd bolt. I tried the straight-up start the other day and it certainly adds some spice to the otherwise easy-ish start.

Does anyone actually know what way Andy G originally did it? Or is that now irrelevant with the 2 bolt extension and therefore the start is as re-climbed with the extension?

I just don't want shot down if I do ever redpoint it.

Fultonius21:00, 6 June 2011

Just wondering who all has repeated this? Definitely 8b? Feels similar to Spitfire 8a+ though I haven't done either... Have holds been lost/gained on the hand rail?

Michael Lee19:17, 18 August 2010

Hold on the rail has changed i believe - but Spitfire seems to be regarded as a tough 8a+...

Mark McGowan19:52, 18 August 2010

I think Tolerance is 8a+ (I think that is the secret consensus among those of us who have repeated it).

Alan Cassidy07:42, 19 August 2010

The ascents I know of are: Dave Mac (FA), Malc, Me, Rob Sutton, Niall McNair

Alan Cassidy07:43, 19 August 2010

...of course, i am quite happy to take 8b for this...albeit a very soft touch 8b!

I think there's a place for soft touch routes such as this though. For those breaking into the grade, it's a great motivator and for those solid at the grade, a nice bit of fun. I think as i get older i feel less inclined to downgrade and just take the grade, there can certainly be some ego-isty (made up word, sorry) involved in downgrading stuff...

exactly which hold has changed?

remember spitfire is half the length of tolerance with almost no shake-outs, tolerance does have an ok-ish stopping place just before you join dum-dum boys and of course the ledge higher up. I think the top moves on spitfire are harder than anything on tolerance but spitfire is much shorter...not really sure what my point is here...

Niall McNair13:09, 19 August 2010

yeah, i'm happy with 8b, especially if all the others are going to be 8a these days. Plus downgarding sucks - I'm hearing my only V12 is now being touted at V10!!!

More on that..... I've done 1 V11 in "the cave" which i thought was V10 but a lot of folk still take at V11 - Sabotage is harder than that ergo min V11 IMH-(route climber's)-O

Alan Cassidy21:31, 19 August 2010
Edited by another user.
Last edit: 12:33, 20 August 2010

Cheers for that. There's an area of freshly exposed rock to the left end of the rail, dunno if it makes it harder though.

...not really sure what my point is here...

That they're difficult to compare?

The aged upgrade, the youth downgrade... I think there is an element of egotism in both. Leave grades as they are unless it's impossible not to change them. In the case of Sabotage... I'd have been embarrassed to've taken 8a+ for it. 8a is fair. It's not 7c+ unless Nic Duboust climbs it!

Michael Lee10:02, 20 August 2010

The left hand side pull on dum dum boys has broken off now... felt freakin' hard today - all thats left is a slopey ripple with a small spike for first finger. Quite happy because it's gotta 8b for sure now.

Michael Lee20:47, 1 September 2010

Merge with dumbarton rock bouldering?

Seems crazy to have these 2 pages seperate?

Michael Lee14:36, 24 April 2010

I changed the link on the guides page to Dumbarton which now has a link to both the routes and bouldering....

Michael Lee15:37, 24 April 2010

Mike, can u add a topo to for the tarrier wall s it would help people suss out lines when visiting from afar.. like Edinburgh ;-) (I dont have software for it)

Mark McGowan18:53, 2 May 2010

Do you a have a suitable photo? If not I'll get one next time I'm down.

Michael Lee17:07, 4 May 2010

Will have a look ...

Mark McGowan17:39, 4 May 2010

This is best Ive got

probably not usable - best shot from top of boulder with a wide angle lens?

Mark McGowan17:58, 4 May 2010

Have a look. It's fine for just now I think.

Michael Lee19:06, 4 May 2010

nice one Mike...

Mark McGowan19:12, 4 May 2010

If my memory serves me correct they used to be on the same page - but got split beacuse they were getting to big... could be wrong

Susan Guest09:38, 26 April 2010
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